the conventions were great on that for obama. and so you could see coming into this, in which they say, look, we are ahead, you are the president, we don't want you out there waving around the 47 percent number. be presidential. but that doesn't really work in debates for all of the reasons we are talking about here, you have an opponent, when romney ride to do it in the republican debate it didn't really work when he had a lead at one point he tried to stay above the fray and he engaged gingrich in a later debate and it worked better and i think the challenge for them now, for the obama team now is, they clearly can't follow the strategy in the second debate. what they also want to avoid a situation that happened with al fore where, al gore where you are seeing a different human being on the stage in the second debate than you are in the first debate. >> rose: go ahead. >> i think there is a certain starkness in the debate that you don't have in the convention. the contrast is extraordinary, in a convention, you are idolized 20,